Author Topic: Organ Pipe Making observations  (Read 6866 times)

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JBR

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Re: Organ Pipe Making observations
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2017, 10:12:04 PM »
I must say, your forum verification process with the questions about organ knowledge are a bit scary and daunting for a novice, and were it not for Google, I'd have never even been able to join here - Is that the intent?

Eh?

I don't remember any of that when I joined.
I am a missionary from Yorkshire to the primitive people of Lancashire

AllenJ

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Re: Organ Pipe Making observations
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2017, 11:38:07 PM »
The sign up process specifically asked me 2 questions (in addition to the graphical CAPTCHA):

Name the composer of the most popular organ piece (or something like that), and it did accept my answer of Bach,

and the more difficult question (for me) :

Name the most common organ stop (which I vaguely knew what a stop was, but had no idea what their names were...  Thank you Google & Wikipedia!)

Thereafter, my first post to the forum also asked me to verify the CAPTCHA, and another organ-related question that I wouldn't expect a novice to know and didn't really know myself, but between guessing and Google, I managed to satisfy it enough to get past it.  I hope to increase my knowledge enough that those don't rattle me, but I've already noticed that it has stopped attempting to thwart my efforts in that fashion, so I must have either worn it out, or the moderators have decided that I'm generally harmless and possibly capable of becoming beneficial someday ;)

I'm not an organist, and musically, I've only been a moderately serious chorus member for a few years with no formal training, and back nearly 40 years ago, I had a few piano lessons when I was going to college for electrical engineering, so I don't even have much background to go on, just an avid hobby interest in the mysterious art of those "boxes of whistles", but now as I grow older and have slightly more control over my surroundings, I can try to make up for the gaps in my youth.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2017, 11:40:50 PM by AllenJ »

JBR

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Re: Organ Pipe Making observations
« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2017, 10:46:31 PM »
No, I had nothing like that.  I'm sure I would have remembered.

Actually, I think it is probably a very good idea in order to deter, or prevent the access of, trolls.  The questions you quoted are the sort of thing that most organists (or non-organist afficionados, such as myself) would be likely to know.

Not being completely serious, but it occurs to me that they could put much more severe questions to people applying to join a hypothetical advanced forum, such as "What is the difference between a Spitz Flute and an Erzähler?"

Not a question I should be able to answer, I must admit!
I am a missionary from Yorkshire to the primitive people of Lancashire

Ian van Deurne

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Re: Organ Pipe Making observations
« Reply #23 on: March 20, 2017, 01:01:00 AM »
Greetings and welcome.

This sounds totally ridiculous.  This forum was set up to be for lovers of the organ,  whether professional or amateur or just for the curious, so I don't see why there should have to be such a deterrent for anyone.  Any of these Internet " Trolls " would I'm sure be given short shrift by anyone here, either by ridiculing their nonsense or by simply ignoring it.

Firstly, your question on the Spitz Flute and Erzaeler.
The Spitz Flute is a medium sized, in bore and cut- up, a robustly - toned flute.  The word ' Spitz " implies that it has an open, invertly tapered body, and it has been traditionally used in the main 8 ft or 4ft flute chorus on the principal keyboard of the organ.  However, different organ builders might have their own interpretation on this.

Secondly, the Erzaeler, which is a little more difficult to explain.
In the USA, it generally denotes a mild - toned string stop, often paired with a Vox Celeste which gives an undulating effect when the two are used together.
       However, my own interpretation of the Erzaeler  (German : Narrator ) has always been a reed register, somewhat similar to a Vox Humana but of a more gentle tone, with emphasis on the vowel sounds on individual pipes within the compass of A, E, O and U, which gives it, when voiced correctly, the nearest sound to a human voice that is actually possible.  I will also admit that this has always been one of my more passionate obsessions when voicing fractional - length reed stops, so I would always devote a great deal of time to these ranks of pipes in order to satisfy my need for perfection.  Because of its subtle nature, this rank has only ever been included in my smaller or medium - sized instruments, but the superb effect of the end result is far more than worth the extra hours of labour in order to get this rank of pipes absolutely perfect.

To return to the original subject.
The craft of making organ pipes has been for many long years a separate apprenticeship.  The training needed to perfect the art of bending, shaping and perfectly soldering metal organ pipes is an art in itself, and only the very largest organ building companies have either the time or money to train their own pipe - making department.  Most organ building firms buy in their organ pipes from specialist companies.  Even the biggest firms who have their own pipe - making department, when faced with delivering large instruments don't have the capacity for manufacturing all their organ pipes on site.
       My own company, which on average is probably middling in size, has always made the principal pipes  (8 ' 4'  2 ' ) of various ratios of a tin alloy, plus all the wooden pipes, which includes the basic stops such as the pedal Bourdon 16, Basfluit 8 ' and the manual Holpijp 8 ',  Fluit dous 4 '  and Woudfluit 2 ',  but all the upper pipework such as the Mixtuur, Cimbel and Scherp, as well as the higher mutations above 1.1/3'  are all outsourced from these companies.  The largest metal pipes, however, such as the 16ft Principals etc, always have to be bought in because there just isn't the space to make them!  The same applies to all the reed stops,  which,  if I was to give a professional secret away, with very few exceptions, are always bought from specialist pipe- makers, whatever the size of the company.
       This doesn't mean that the organ builder who buys these pipes has any less control over how they will eventually sound.  The dimensions of each rank of pipes have already been specified by the customer, and upon delivery each individual rank of pipes will still be voiced to realize their own interpretation of how they want their organ to speak.

With best wishes
Ian.

JBR

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Re: Organ Pipe Making observations
« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2017, 10:23:54 PM »
Firstly, your question on the Spitz Flute and Erzaeler.
The Spitz Flute is a medium sized, in bore and cut- up, a robustly - toned flute.  The word ' Spitz " implies that it has an open, invertly tapered body, and it has been traditionally used in the main 8 ft or 4ft flute chorus on the principal keyboard of the organ.  However, different organ builders might have their own interpretation on this.

Secondly, the Erzaeler, which is a little more difficult to explain.
In the USA, it generally denotes a mild - toned string stop, often paired with a Vox Celeste which gives an undulating effect when the two are used together.
       However, my own interpretation of the Erzaeler  (German : Narrator ) has always been a reed register

Thanks for your explanation.

I asked the question because, outwardly at least, the Spitz Flute and the Ezähler look very similar (in being tapered).  Consequently, I always thought that they must sound fairly similar too, although I realise that appearances can be deceptive and there are a number of alterations that can be made to change the sound of a pipe quite radically.

I can't say I have ever seen an Ezähler on a British organ, and had assumed that it was an entirely American thing which was just another name for a Spitz Flute or perhaps a Gemshorn.

If a mild string stop, then, could it be somewhat similar to a Spitzgamba which, I think, is more likely to be found in German speaking areas?

I confess that I was completely unaware that there were Ezählers in the form of reed stops.
I am a missionary from Yorkshire to the primitive people of Lancashire

 


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