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We are talking about "small" organs, right Will have to give this one a listen one day...http://members.cox.net/subbass16/opus8.htmThe "post-accident" rebuilt instrument came in at USD$125,000
Hi!I'm wondering if one can design a really exciting organ with minimum spec?RecitSalicionalVoix CelestePrincipalCornet V - in seperately registerable ranksTrompetteBombardeGrande OrgueMontre 8Principal 4Bourdon 8Flute 4Fifteenth 2Sifflot 1En Chamade trumpet 8PositifQuintadina 8Flute 8Flute 4Tierce Piccolo 1Cromorne 8PedalBourdonBombarde from RecitOh dear - that comes to over 20 ranks . . . £500k ? One might enclose Recit and Positif . . . Temperament - Kellner or D'Alembert?Best wishesForum Admin
Listening to an MP3 of this gem... http://www.magle.dk/pipe-organ-jorlunde-church.htmlClick on the links and give it a listen... EricKB7DQH
Quote from: organforumadmin on April 17, 2010, 01:13:46 PMHi!I'm wondering if one can design a really exciting organ with minimum spec?RecitSalicionalVoix CelestePrincipalCornet V - in seperately registerable ranksTrompetteBombardeGrande OrgueMontre 8Principal 4Bourdon 8Flute 4Fifteenth 2Sifflot 1En Chamade trumpet 8PositifQuintadina 8Flute 8Flute 4Tierce Piccolo 1Cromorne 8PedalBourdonBombarde from RecitOh dear - that comes to over 20 ranks . . . £500k ? One might enclose Recit and Positif . . . Temperament - Kellner or D'Alembert?Best wishesForum AdminSimples... http://www.npor.org.uk/cgi-bin/Rsearch.cgi?Fn=Rsearch&rec_index=P00563There simply never has been a 16-stop organ that versatile before. It does pretty much everything convincingly. Now, it just needs an acoustic to speak into...
To take the Récit first: there is a solitary Principal 4ft., but no 8ft. Diapason - or even an 8ft. Flute (it would be extremely unusual for the Cornet to sound below G20 at the lowest). The Bombarde is presumably of 16ft. pitch. This could be rather heavy in a small instrument. There is no quiet 8ft. reed, such as an Hautbois.
The G.O. is a little better, although the idea of a chamade reed on a small instrument which, whilst not original,* is probably unnecessary.
On the Positive Organ, there is a Tierce, but no Nazard. This is almost pointless. As another contributor has stated on a different thread, the Tierce was never used in French Classical music without the Nazard.
In addition, there is another 1ft. stop. One in such a small scheme is perhaps a luxury - two I consider to be wasteful, particularly since there is apparently no 2ft. stop on the Positif.
Whilst the Quintadena will (or should) be voiced to accentuate the twelfth, this is not at all the same as a separate mutation rank at 2 2/3ft. pitch.
To keep to a similar size, but spread over two claviers and pedals, I should prefer something along the following lines:PEDAL ORGANViolone (W) 16Bourdon 16Quint (Std. W) 10 2/3Violoncello (M) 8Stopped Flute (Ext.) 8Bassoon (W) 16Great to PedalSwell to PedalSwell 4ft. to PedalGREAT ORGANOpen Diapason 8Stopped Diapason 8Principal 4Harmonic Flute 4Fifteenth 2Sesquialtera (12-17) IITremulantSwell 16ft. to GreatSwell to GreatSwell 4ft. to GreatSWELL ORGANOpen Diapason 8Flauto Traverso 8Viola da Gamba 8Voix Célestes (AA) 8Gemshorn (Conical) 4Mixture (15-19-22) IIIHautboy 8Trumpet 8TremulantSub OctaveOctavePedal to Great PistonsGreat to Pedal PistonsTuning: equal temperament.NOTESThe Violone could be of metal, with the lowest notes Haskelled, if necessary.The Quint should be voiced as 'dull' as possible, and is intended to be used in conjunction with the Violone.The G.O. Sesquialtera would be of wide scale, voiced with good blending qualities. In addtition to providing a useful solo voice (in combination, of course), it would also help to compensate for the lack of a chorus reed.[/font]
I am assuming that we're talking here of an instrument designed for liturgical use, some impressive voluntaries and maybe some recitals. Shall we say 20 ranks? Here's my nearly-all-enclosed take:Pedal1 - Acoustic Bass 32' (unison from Great Bass, quint from Dulciana)2 - Great Bass 16' (open wood pipes, large scale, high pressure)3 - Dulciana 16' (from GO)4 - Bourdon 16' (from Swell)5 - Octave 8' (ext. Great Bass)6 - Flute 8' (ext. Bourdon)7 - Flute 4' (ext. Bourdon)8 - Trombone 16' (ext. GO Posaune)9 - Baryton 16' (from Swell)10 - Posaune 8' (from GO)Great11 - Dulciana 16' (unenclosed)12 - Open Diapason I 8' (leathered, high pressure)13 - Open Diapason II 8' (unenclosed)14 - Hohl Flute 8'15 - Principal 4' (unenclosed)16 - Octave Flute 4'17 - Fifteenth 2' (unenclosed)18 - Mixture IV (188.8.131.52) (unenclosed, to be installed when funds permit more ranks)19 - Posaune 8' (enclosed in own box)Swell20 - Lieblich Bourdon 16'21 - Viole d'Orchestre 8'22 - Voix celeste 8'23 - Lieblich Gedact 8' (independent of L.Bourdon)24 - Lieblich Flute 4'25 - Flautina 2'26 - Baryton 16'27 - Cornopean 8'28 - Hautboy 8'29 - Vox Humana 8'30 - Clarinet 8'Choir31 - Dulciana 16'32 - Viola 8'33 - Celeste 8'34 - Hohl Flute 8'35 - Lieblich Flute 8'36 - Unda Maris 8' (from 8ft flutes)37 - Octave Flute 4'38 - Lieblich Flute 4'39 - Flautina 2'40 - Baryton 16'41 - Vox Humana 8'42 - Hautboy 8'43 - Clarinet 8'44 - Posaune 8'45 - Cornopean 8'Solo46 - Open Diapason 8' (from GO No1)47 - Viole d'Orchestre 8' (from Swell)48 - Hohl Flute 8' (from GO)49 - Octave Flute 4' (from GO)50 - Trombone 16' (from Pedal)51 - Cornopean 8' (from Swell)52 - Solo Posaune 8' (from Great Posaune)53 - Clarinet 8' (from Swell)The Unda Maris (a flute celeste) might be a cheat, but it ought to work, the two ranks beating slightly against each other - an idea nicked from PCND5584's post on the Mander forum of Jan 2 2006... The unenclosed Great diapason chorus would be along Lewis/Walcker lines, the rest more Norman & Beardish... and if you think that won't work, go and hear the 1902 N&B in Colchester's Moot Hall! Lewis was working for N&B at the time and so it's a lot brighter than you'd expect. Also, if you wish to quibble with the widespread use of pedal ranks on the manuals, or the placing of the Vox Humana on a separate manual (as at Saint-Brieuc) go and complain to Monsieur Cavaillé-Coll! This one is admittedly borrowed from the Swell, but could be used thereby either as a solo stop or in alternatim with other Swell stops. The whole Choir is, actually, derived from other manuals, as per Mercklin practice, with the exception of the Clarinet (Belgian-style free-reed?). The Baryton stop is a sort of 16ft Vox Humana, used by Willis, C-C, Brindley & Foster and others - useful not only as a chorus reed but also for the full Wurlitzer effect!So, a four-manual (sort of), 53-stop instrument, all from just twenty ranks, without any manual extension (except the Solo Trombone/Posaune)! I've modified the post several times and it's turned into a sort of Audsleyesque concept, albeit without a load of floating departments (though I suppose each manual department could be floating, so it could be assigned to any manual). I guess the next step would be to go down the Compton route and extend everything... or is that cheating?I'm sure the high-pressure reeds and leathered diapasons will please PCND
... As a comment in passing rather than in any way considering the schemes comprehensively off the cuff, I'm not quite sure of the value of a 16 Quintaton as the main 16ft base for the manuals as the 5th close to the 8ft is out of the 8ft harmonic series and will muddy it up. It all depends on how subtle it is, I suppose. . . but presumably it will provide a richesse. ...Best wishesDavid P
The JW Walker insrument at Wimborne Minster has such a stop as the only G.O. sub-unison flue. It is, quite simply, superb; and I would not exchange it for a second. It is something of a chameleon, being able to provide a suitable foundation for the full G.O., yet also blending well with the flutes. It is a most versatile stop - even effective played an octave higher as a solo.
Quote from: pcnd5584 on July 12, 2011, 11:53:59 PMThe JW Walker insrument at Wimborne Minster has such a stop as the only G.O. sub-unison flue. It is, quite simply, superb; and I would not exchange it for a second. It is something of a chameleon, being able to provide a suitable foundation for the full G.O., yet also blending well with the flutes. It is a most versatile stop - even effective played an octave higher as a solo.Hi!Interesting. One of Colin Pykett's researches to which some of my posts yesterday pointed looks at the way in which some stops fit harmonics into others. An example of this that he talks about is the way in which a 4ft Principal fits its harmonics into the gaps of the harmonics of the 8ft Stopped Diapason. It's for this reason that on small instruments one does not need two Open Diapasons. One supposes that the Quintadena does this sort of thing in a particularly coloured way setting up the chorus at 16ft pitch giving the instrument the gravitas of a much larger Seize Pieds instrument.Best wishesDavid P