Mixture Compositions???

[KB7DQH]

A recent article about the Boardwalk Hall  Midmer-Losh organ restoration has gathered some comments about the mixture composition "as-built" and whether there might be a benefit to changing them...

# Mixtures — anonympous 2012-04-09 22:01
In 1949 Emerson Richards wrote in the American Organist that the mixture designs at Atlantic City would be better served minus the thirds, sevenths,ninths etc. and be far more utilitarian as generally quint mixtures in the main divisions of the organ with some exceptions.He admitted that he did not previously understand the resultant effects that certain partials create thus transposing music downward by the synthesis of 16' tone produced by partials in the mixtures that are from the 16' series. Partials like 3-1/5,5-1/3, 2-2/7 etc in the upper ends of the chorus mixtures. These observations should be noted and the revisions made in the restoration so that the organ is not merely a museum piece but a viable modern organ with glorious diapason choruses minus the grave tone of 16' series harmonics as explained above. Some exceptions would be where reed choruses can benefit from 3-1/5, 5-1/3 and 2-2/7' partials to heighten the harmonics naturally present in chorus reed tone and some clang, edge and eclat to the sound.

... or not...

# Restoration — Dennis Steckley 2012-04-10 11:23
Sorry, but I strongly feel it should be restored musically AS IS without changes to the stop list. An instrument of 33,000 pipes can certainly play anything convincingly. Changing it is the equivalent of redoing the smile on the Mona Lisa because the dentist want to show her nice teeth.


# Mixtures — Timothy Tikker 2012-04-10 16:32
While it's true that many of the mixtures in this organ have thirds and sevenths, many do not. So it should be possible to choose registrations in this organ that allow for more standard sounds for most repertory by being selective in one's choice of mixtures and other stops. This organ is such an extraordinary conception as it stands that it would be best to preserve it tonally unchanged.

http://www.newsworks.org/index.php/new-jersey-more/item/36667-breathing-new-life-into-worlds-largest-pipe-organ-in-atlantic-city


Discussion to follow ???

Eric
KB7DQH

[Pierre Lauwers]

There has been much misunderstanding about the mixtures during the 20th century; The Orgelbewegung saw them merely as a color, not as corroborating stops.
"Quint-and-octaves-only" Principal choruses were to be find in Italy (indeed, it was the complete organ then), and in France since the second part of the 17th century, when the organ was litterally divided into two parts.
And then there was the british Diapason chorus (open 8', stopped 8', Principal, Twelfth and Fifteenth), but above that there was nothing, or a Mixture that often had a tierce rank and lended to add the trumpet as well.
So the limitation to quint mixtures only is in fact a generalization of the french fashion from the 18th century, where the lavish Principal choruses, topped by extremely rich Fournitures and Cymbales, was a kind of seperate full organ, and used as such, in chords, never for polyphonic music.
Now when people like Marcel Dupré decreted that even Bach had to be played with such mixtures, it soon became evident the 5 1/3', or even 10 2/3' ranks (Isnard, de Joyeuse, Clicquot) would be a problem, so those ranks were
avoided as far as possible. Dupré permitted the 5 1/3', if any, only in the last octave of the compass....But remember that to him the compass was 61 notes !
So we had quite brillant stops which did not blend at all with the rest, nor corroborated anything, as a color one could actually add to whatever registration (It is noteworthy that E-M Skinner understood them exactly that way as well).
It is indeed a post-romantic concept rather than a baroque one.
The baroque masters built mainly corroborative stops that were meant for loud registrations, not to be heard by themselves.

I believe it is time to change our conceptions in that matter, and that we accept the fact there are countless different mixture designs which existed and deserve preservation. This answers the question about Atlantic City...

Best wishes,
Pierre

[pcnd5584]

... So we had quite brillant stops which did not blend at all with the rest, nor corroborated anything, as a color one could actually add to whatever registration (It is noteworthy that E-M Skinner understood them exactly that way as well).
It is indeed a post-romantic concept rather than a baroque one.
The baroque masters built mainly corroborative stops that were meant for loud registrations, not to be heard by themselves.

I believe it is time to change our conceptions in that matter, and that we accept the fact there are countless different mixture designs which existed and deserve preservation. This answers the question about Atlantic City...

Best wishes,
Pierre

I am not so sure that Skinner understood anything at all about mixtures, Pierre - particularly not after reading the whole of Charles Callahan's book The American Classic Organ. It is quite clear from the letters (particularly those between Skinner and Henry Willis III) that he [Skinner] had little or no understanding of any of the functions of compound stops - of any type. Willis III (who was not exactly a proponent of neo-Baroque instruments) attempted to demonstrate to Skinner how invaluable mixtures were - and also of the importance of proper choruses. However, initially, Shinner was only interested in Willis' chorus reeds. It was only on a subesquent visit, some years later, that he became aware of the musical value of chorus mixtures. In particular, he was utterly taken with the Grand Chorus V (15-19-22-26-29) on the G.O. at  Westminster Cathedral.

I would agree that there are indeed countless mixture schemes - many of which deserve preservation. However, I remain unconvinced that there is any musical value whatsoever in a Harrison 'Harmonics' (17-19-flat 21-22). In this regard, I would suggest that, if one agrees that the design of Arthur Harrison's trombe was fundamentally flawed, then the 'Harmonics' was also redundant. Whilst I realise that this stop was as an attempt to marry Harrison's opaque, harmonically dead G.O. reeds to the rest of the chorus, in reality these stops were often so powerful that they simply swamped practically everything else, except for a Tuba and a Pedal Ophicleide (if present).

[Pierre Lauwers]

The "Harmonics" stop must be compared with the "Grand Cornet", which role it actually has, not with the
Mixture stops like Fourniture and Cymbale.
The Tromba kind of reed has much advantages, though.
Consider first the problems provoked by its contrary, the french chorus reeds.
In many places in France and in Belgium, those stops dominate strongly all the rest. And as they are quite more
powerfull in the bass part of the compass, whenever the acoustics is a bit generous, the result is a roaring,
unique note that prevails, and one hears nothing more from the right hand of the player !
The Tromba, on the other hand, has its basses tamed down by the (nearly) closed shallots, and there is a better
balance between bass and treble.
The Harmonics -with only one break, and the highest possible- is indeed there to add brillancy, and even a hint
of treble ascendancy.
The concept existed on the continent with some post-romantic builders like Weigle, who added septime ranks to Kornett-Mixtur stops, in order to cope with high-pressure reeds. So there is a logic behind it.

Best wishes,
Pierre

[David Drinkell]

I would agree that there are indeed countless mixture schemes - many of which deserve preservation. However, I remain unconvinced that there is any musical value whatsoever in a Harrison 'Harmonics' (17-19-flat 21-22). In this regard, I would suggest that, if one agrees that the design of Arthur Harrison's trombe was fundamentally flawed, then the 'Harmonics' was also redundant. Whilst I realise that this stop was as an attempt to marry Harrison's opaque, harmonically dead G.O. reeds to the rest of the chorus, in reality these stops were often so powerful that they simply swamped practically everything else, except for a Tuba and a Pedal Ophicleide (if present). [/font]

I don't agree that the design of AH's trombas was fundamentally flawed.  If they were very loud indeed, they were probably intended primarily as solo stops.  Everyone did this at the time - the Tromba at St. Magnus Cathedral is a Willis tuba in all but name.  The 1907 Trombas at Belfast Cathedral acted as remarkably good chorus reeds to the 1975 Positive.  Similarly, I wouldn't be so quick to scrap a Harmonics as people once were.  They weren't/aren't nearly so anti-social as is sometimes claimed.  Harry Bramma  says the example at Worcester was a useful alternative to the quint mixture.  I think I would prefer one to a lot of Hill tierce mixtures I have met.....

Modification/replacement sometimes works, but not always.  The quint mixture which replaced the Harmonics at Leicester Cathedral worked very well, IMHO, but the similar exercise at Belfast (using some of the old pipes) most certainly didn't.

[MusingMuso]

The "Harmonics" stop must be compared with the "Grand Cornet", which role it actually has, not with the
Mixture stops like Fourniture and Cymbale.
The Tromba kind of reed has much advantages, though.
Consider first the problems provoked by its contrary, the french chorus reeds.
In many places in France and in Belgium, those stops dominate strongly all the rest. And as they are quite more
powerfull in the bass part of the compass, whenever the acoustics is a bit generous, the result is a roaring,
unique note that prevails, and one hears nothing more from the right hand of the player !
The Tromba, on the other hand, has its basses tamed down by the (nearly) closed shallots, and there is a better
balance between bass and treble.
The Harmonics -with only one break, and the highest possible- is indeed there to add brillancy, and even a hint
of treble ascendancy.
The concept existed on the continent with some post-romantic builders like Weigle, who added septime ranks to Kornett-Mixtur stops, in order to cope with high-pressure reeds. So there is a logic behind it.

Best wishes,
Pierre

Why should the French Trompette be considered the alternative to the Harrison-style Tromba?

What was wrong with the Posaunes of Fr Willis, or the magnificent chorus-reeds found in many Hill, Norman & Beard organs?

There are considerable differences between using high-pressure to achieve strong-trebles, scorching power or powerful smoothness. Indeed, the last listed requires the highest wind-pressure, (usually around 10" wg),but to no great musical advantage. I personally dislike French chorus-reeds; preferring instead the English trumpet/posaune variety. Even major reeds don't need to be very close in tone, and when Hill, Norman & Beard set out to crteate an impact reed, they could do it better than most others. One of the very finest is the Trumpet Major at Bradford Cathedral, (7" wg), which even after being tamed slightly, is a fairly arresting sort of register which blends perfectly with the rest of the instrument.

My own view,(and it is a personal view), is that Lt Col George Dixon was an idiot of the first order, who knew nothing at all about proper organ-tone.

In any event, why do we wish to perpetuate a perverse quirk of musical fashion which, at best, lasted less than 50 years?

It has a very limited relevance to the history of the organ and the mainstream repertoire written for it.

MM

[Pierre Lauwers]

"why do we wish to perpetuate a perverse quirk of musical fashion which, at best, lasted less than 50 years?"
(Quote)

Simply because it works, as a growing majority of people busy with the organ (I mean organists, organ-builders...) in continental Europe recognize it. But no worry, you may continue to export those stops (and, by the way, the complete organs that surround them) by the tons, wr will be happy to rescue and enjoy them.

Best wishes,
Pierre

[MusingMuso]

How many Belgian chocolates do I get for a complete Tromba?   ;D

MM

[Pierre Lauwers]

How many Belgian chocolates do I get for a complete Tromba?   ;D

MM

100,00 Pounds, plus a complete rank of 1970 Cymbel ;D

[pcnd5584]

I don't agree that the design of AH's trombas was fundamentally flawed.  If they were very loud indeed, they were probably intended primarily as solo stops.  Everyone did this at the time - the Tromba at St. Magnus Cathedral is a Willis tuba in all but name.  The 1907 Trombas at Belfast Cathedral acted as remarkably good chorus reeds to the 1975 Positive.  Similarly, I wouldn't be so quick to scrap a Harmonics as people once were.  They weren't/aren't nearly so anti-social as is sometimes claimed.  Harry Bramma  says the example at Worcester was a useful alternative to the quint mixture.  I think I would prefer one to a lot of Hill tierce mixtures I have met.....

Modification/replacement sometimes works, but not always.  The quint mixture which replaced the Harmonics at Leicester Cathedral worked very well, IMHO, but the similar exercise at Belfast (using some of the old pipes) most certainly didn't.

Maybe - but there is a world of difference between some Arthur Harrison Trombe and most Willis Tuba stops - even if they are by HW III, and not FHW. Whilst I realise that AH's Tromba stops were not all the same, nevertheless there are a good number still around which speak on pressures between 250mm and 300mm. King's College, Cambridge are voiced on approximately 400mm - which is just too much for G.O. reeds, to my mind - even if they are enclosed in the Solo expression box.

In any case, this is partly my point - if the G.O. reeds are too loud (or too opaque) to use as chorus stops, then they are  simply too loud. On a three-clavier instrument (with or without a solo reed on the Choir or Positive), surely the most important function is as part of the full G.O. - any solo capability should be a secondary consideration.

Out of interest, were the G.O. reeds at Belfast retained exactly as before in 1975, or were they revoiced, perhaps on a lower pressure and/or with thinner tongues?

Saint Peter's, Bournemouth is a case in point. The G.O. reeds there still speak on a pressure of 250mm. Having played this organ many times (I was formerly Sub Organist for a while), I never did like them. Although they are now labelled as Posaune and Octave Posaune, they are still quite fat - and lack any attack at all, their speech being a little sluggish. I greatly prefer my 'own' reeds here - even if they do speak on a pressure of approximately 80mm - to my ears, they are infinitely more musical than those at Saint Peter's Church.

Harmonics - I am not convinced! I had understood that most piano manufacturers 'voiced' pianos so that the seventh harmonic was kept very 'quiet'. I must confess that I simply have no use for the anti-social jangle of a flat twenty-first in a compound stop. As a separate mutation, with a totally different construction and voicing, in combination with other flute ranks, it can produce some piquant effects - but even then, a stop at this pitch (or even 2 2/7ft.) has a somewhat limited appeal.

[pcnd5584]

PCND should look at the specifications of two unaltered vintage EMS organs - the 4/197 in Woolsey Hall, Yale, and the rather smaller 4m in the Cathedral of Our Lady of the Rosary, Toledo, Ohio. These instruments have several manuals on which are present quite complete diapason choruses up to quint mixtures of a considerable number of ranks (four being generally the minimum). In addition to these, there can be found tierce mixtures, Harrison-type Harmonics and even Cornets. Labelling EMS in the same league as Robert Hope-Jones in terms of use of choruswork is unfair to Skinner and misunderstands what he and Hope-Jones (whom EMS knew and worked with briefly, but disliked and disagreed with profoundly) sought to achieve.

Actually I have. But you simply cannot judge an instrument effectively from a paper specification. Ralph Downes was initially quite excited to receive the stop-list of the Princeton Chapel organ, but was bitterly disappointed when he played and heard it for the first time. (And please do not reply with comments regarding his hearing - the only source I know of this, was from Aeolian-Skinner. It seemed perfectly fine when I met him.)

Perhaps you can point me to exactly where (and in what context) I put Skinner in the same league as Hope-Jones; it would help to see exactly what I wrote, since I cannot now recall this.

Listen to what HW III wrote, on hearing large Skinner organs for the first time (remember that Willis was extremely well-travelled and kept himself well-informed of developments in several key countries):

"Skinner does not treat upper work in the manner we consider correct on this side of the Atlantic. The principal is usually less than two-thirds the power of the 8ft., with the fifteenth (if present: it was frequently omitted on quite decent sized schemes) smaller again in proportion. The mutation and mixture work (when present) is of dulciana power, and results in an overwhelming dominance of the unison in the flue build-up, the chorus reeds coming on without having been led up to." *  Remember also, that Skinner frequently leathered his diapason stops. There are further comments regarding other instruments (for example, that at the Cathedral of Saint John the Divine, NYC), which serve further to higlight the deficiency in the chorus structures of these instruments.



* Article by Henry Willis III (America Visited). pp. 117-8. The Organ, October 1925. Musical Opinion; London.

Has PCND encountered a Harrison in which the Trombas are enclosed? They sometimes were and still are at King's Cambridge (possibly others too, but I can only remember that one off the top of my head) - and, indeed, in Dixon's designs (such as at Whitehaven) they were to be found on the Orchestral manual, with their own transfer-to-Great coupler.

Yes, I have. For the record, All Saints'. Margaret Street (an instrument on which I occasionally used to practise) is another example, although here, the G.O. reeds are more akin to fairly normal Trumpets than Trombe.

I have yet to hear an example of A.H. Trombas (trombe isn't a word)...

Yes, it is - it is the correct plural of the feminine singular 'tromba'. If we are going to descend into arguments regarding the perceived mis-appropriation of English grammatical construction to loan-words, we shall be here until the proverbial cows come home.

... or Harmonics live - my own experience of his organs being confined to smaller examples where neither is present - but I would be interested to know why the Harmonics stayed unenclosed on the Great when the Trombas were enclosed and sometimes on a different manual. I note that, in a recent restoration, All Saints Margaret Street regained its long-lost Harmonics...

I recall that there was a Harrison-type Harmonics on the Solo organ at Downside Abbey. It was derived, I believe, from string ranks and could be used with them as an additional tonal colour. Indeed, Compton considered this combination so successful that he gave it its own stop-button, labelled "Kalophone". This can be found in other Compton organs, too, including Weston-super-Mare Parish Church. It can be heard here: http://www.walckerorgel.de/gewalcker.de/Derett%20MP3/12%20-%20Suite%20Evocatrice-%20Tierce%20En%20Taille%20Et%20Recit%20De%20Chromorne.mp3.

There is also, on the Bombarde manual, as well as Trombas 8 & 4 and Tubas 16, 8 & 4, an extraordinary "Grand Cornet", composed thus: 1.5.8.10.12.14.15.16.17.19.22. Note the Septième at 2 2/7, an octave lower than in Harrison Harmonics, and the two Tierces, plus a Neuvième 1 7/9. What does PCND think of the recent addition of an independent Septième to the Gloucester Cathedral organ's Positive division?

It is not a recent addition - it was altered (simply by moving up the old Larigot of the West Positive by three notes) at the time of the 1999-2000 rebuild. Trust me, I was having lessons on this instrument then; and there were a few changes that were not publicised at that time.

With reagrd to derived compound stops at Downside Abbey, the problem with this is that it produces discrepancies in tuning - it is simply not enough to obtain a Tierce from a Vox Angelica.

Given the choice between the pseudo-French screamers at Gloucester (which obliterate the Downes-vandalised Harris Great diapason chorus) and big, wide English Trombas with tierce mixtures and big-scaled diapasons for company, I'll take the latter every time. Compton's chorus reeds were extremely fine - as Richard Hills' new CD at Southampton Guildhall demonstrates amply. I may soon upload a couple of tracks off that disc to YouTube, pending permission from Peter Hammond.

Each has a right to their own preference - but I cannot allow you to accuse Downes of vandalism - particularly since some of the Harris case pipes had been silent for many years. In any case, since there are a number of well-documented instances of organ builders doing far worse to old pipe work, this is hardly relevant; for example, Wells Cathedral (Green / FHW) or Worcester Cathedral (Hill / Hope-Jones) - now  that was vandalism.

[David Drinkell]

Out of interest, were the G.O. reeds at Belfast retained exactly as before in 1975, or were they revoiced, perhaps on a lower pressure and/or with thinner tongues?

As far as I know, they were not altered, although they would have been refinished when the rebuilt organ was installed in the new transept and I guess quite a lot can happen in such a process.  The way they made perfect chorus reeds to the 1960s/70s Positif was quite incredible - and not considered as a possibility by many players.  They were as smooth as butter, but not terrifically loud compared with some.  But, I believe Schnitger's chorus reeds were often as smooth as he got make them 9leathered shallots and all), so perhaps it wasn't such a chalk-and-cheese mix after all.

Incidentally, at the rebuild, a Sub Octave Reeds coupler disappeared (as did the Octave, Sub and UO on the Solo), which messed up the concept of the Great.  It's back again now.

[pcnd5584]

Out of interest, were the G.O. reeds at Belfast retained exactly as before in 1975, or were they revoiced, perhaps on a lower pressure and/or with thinner tongues?

As far as I know, they were not altered, although they would have been refinished when the rebuilt organ was installed in the new transept and I guess quite a lot can happen in such a process.  The way they made perfect chorus reeds to the 1960s/70s Positif was quite incredible - and not considered as a possibility by many players.  They were as smooth as butter, but not terrifically loud compared with some.  But, I believe Schnitger's chorus reeds were often as smooth as he got make them 9leathered shallots and all), so perhaps it wasn't such a chalk-and-cheese mix after all.

Incidentally, at the rebuild, a Sub Octave Reeds coupler disappeared (as did the Octave, Sub and UO on the Solo), which messed up the concept of the Great.  It's back again now.

Thank you for this, David - very interesting!

I was surprised to read of the loss of the Solo octave couplers, but glad to hear that at least the Sub Octave Reeds has been re-instated.

I note your point regarding the use of the G.O. reeds as Positive chorus reeds - this is also interesting and, as you state, not necessarily something which would immediately present itself as a viable option. On my own church instrument, I can do the opposite - the Positive Crumhorn makes a good chorus reed, either for the Positive or the G.O. - or as part of a combination to produce a surprisingly realistic faux Tuba Minor.

[MusingMuso]

This for David......

Schnitger's reeds were never "chorus reeds" at all.  (See PS below)

They would never have used them as such, but as an alternative to the full ensemble. The winding of the organs (very narrow channels) wouldn't allow combinations of 8ft and 16ft stops, and if a 16ft reed was drawn on the pedal, the 16ft Pincipal was pushed in. Same thing on the manuals at 8ft pitch, because the winding would result in one register drawing wind from the other and making it sound out of tune.

I always like to think of Schnitger reeds, (the Trumpet type of registers, with leathered shallots), as akin to Gabrieli's use of antiphonal brass at Venice.

It's one of the reasons why the Arp Schnitger type of instrument belongs to the North German school of composers such as Buxtehude, Reinken and Bruhns, (et al) and the vivid tonal contrasts of "Stylus Phantasticus."

It's a very different way of making music compared to things going on further South at the time.

MM

PS: Since writing the above, I realised that it could mislead. I meant to say that the reeds would not be used with ALL the Principal chorus drawn due to lack of wind, but of course, they could be used as a foundation to the higher pitches and therefore produce a different timbre altogether. It's difficult to explain without being sat at a Schnitger organ console, and we don't have many of those in the UK.

[MusingMuso]

I've really struggled to find this, but I'm delighted to have done so.

Here is the way Schnitger reeds would (ed: may) have been used, even played fugally on their own:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9meNsHoI74M&feature=related

This, by the way, is an absolutely "must hear" organ, at the A-akerk, Groningen, in the Netherlands.

MM

[AnOrganCornucopia]

Perhaps you can point me to exactly where (and in what context) I put Skinner in the same league as Hope-Jones; it would help to see exactly what I wrote, since I cannot now recall this.

I've just trawled through all of your posts and can't find it now, but I distinctly remember reading it and replying to it. Oh well!

Listen to what HW III wrote, on hearing large Skinner organs for the first time (remember that Willis was extremely well-travelled and kept himself well-informed of developments in several key countries):

"Skinner does not treat upper work in the manner we consider correct on this side of the Atlantic. The principal is usually less than two-thirds the power of the 8ft., with the fifteenth (if present: it was frequently omitted on quite decent sized schemes) smaller again in proportion. The mutation and mixture work (when present) is of dulciana power, and results in an overwhelming dominance of the unison in the flue build-up, the chorus reeds coming on without having been led up to." *  Remember also, that Skinner frequently leathered his diapason stops. There are further comments regarding other instruments (for example, that at the Cathedral of Saint John the Divine, NYC), which serve further to highlight the deficiency in the chorus structures of these instruments.

Remember that a big Skinner could have three or four 8ft ODs on the Great - not all of which by any means would be leathered. I wouldn't describe Girard College, Philadelphia, for example, as lacking brilliance in the upperwork and mixtures. Remember, HW3's idea of a normal chorus mixture was that huge five-ranker at Westminster which nearly takes your head off when drawn!

* Article by Henry Willis III (America Visited). pp. 117-8. The Organ, October 1925. Musical Opinion; London.[/font]

(The Septième at Gloucester) is not a recent addition - it was altered (simply by moving up the old Larigot of the West Positive by three notes) at the time of the 1999-2000 rebuild. Trust me, I was having lessons on this instrument then; and there were a few changes that were not publicised at that time.

All right, recent alteration rather than addition. As a Septième is a 21st and a Larigot is a 19th, surely it was moved two notes, not three?

With regard to derived compound stops at Downside Abbey, the problem with this is that it produces discrepancies in tuning - it is simply not enough to obtain a Tierce from a Vox Angelica.

The unisons will be bang on, the quints barely out at all and deriving the Tierces from celestes sorts them out too. Where they are derived from straight-tuned ranks, it doesn't matter too much as they are only there to give gentle colour, which they do well.

I cannot allow you to accuse Downes of vandalism - particularly since some of the Harris case pipes had been silent for many years. In any case, since there are a number of well-documented instances of organ builders doing far worse to old pipe work, this is hardly relevant; for example, Wells Cathedral (Green / FHW) or Worcester Cathedral (Hill / Hope-Jones) - now  that was vandalism.

I don't care that they'd been silent. Downes still took pipes which retained their original 1665 Thomas Harris voicing and opened up the toes, increasing the cut-up, just to get the things to speak on the too-low pressure he insisted was correct. The result is a very thin, quinty sound utterly devoid of warmth and wholly unable to balance the extremely raw reeds. This is, by any reasonable yardstick, vandalism of historic material. Citing other examples where historic material was binned is irrelevant and does not excuse Downes. At least what you got at Wells and Worcester were characteristic Willis and Hope-Jones organs, with all their various strengths and weaknesses, the old material simply not re-used at all. At Gloucester, if anything it is worse that the Harris pipes survived unmolested into an era in which one would have supposed them to be the recipients of reverential care, not ideological revoicing and that the result is simply unmusical. Don't get me wrong, Gloucester has many strengths (those reeds are quite thrilling over full organ, the strings and Vox Humana are gorgeous and the flutes and upperwork can give many wonderful piquant efrects) but the Great diapason chorus is a great weakness. Incidentally, I know how much you value a Swell OD8 for accompanying - how does Gloucester fare in that regard without one?

Oh, I'm so looking forward to hearing the new Smithfield Schoenstein slusher...