Width of keys

[Janner]

This question is prompted by a discussion which has started in "Another place," but I don't yet see there an answer.

How, when and why did the width of piano / organ keys get standardised, in the main, to the present sizes? I say in the main because there are of course keyboard instruments with different size keys; accordions for example.

Logically, it would seem that slightly narrower keys would make it easier to span more notes, although I suppose it would reduce the "Target area," especially for some of the more vigorous pianio pieces. Or was it possibly something to do with the piano mechanisms attached to the keys, or the layout of the strings?

Moving away from the normal keyboard altogether to something like the chromatic button key accordion, it becomes possible to span an even greater range, and in a five row arrangement they even offer choices of fingering, although they (the keyboards not the instruments)* are perhaps not well suited to the organ repertoire.

Thinking about it, I suppose concentrating a tracker mechanism into the length occupied by the keys of a button keyboard may be a difficult task. Of course nowadays there would be the option of an electric action; wires don't take up much room!

Were some apparently difficult pieces from the past actually written for different size keyboards?

Do the inhabitants of this eminent forum have any answers?

(* Post modified to avoid ambiguity.) (Or perhaps it should read "And the instruments.")  :))

[revtonynewnham]

Hi

As far as I'm aware, there is no standard for key sizes - just tradition (although possibly for organ keys, the RCO standard might lay down sizes - I've never had cause to look).  The biggest problem with smaller keys is when you come to play chords  in the slightly more remote keys.  It sometimes becomes necessary to play white notes with fingers between the black keys (because you're also playing them) - too narrow a gap and the result is far from pleasant!  I sometimes have this problem on conventionally sized keyboards where the maker has used wide sharps.

Every Blessing

Tony

[revtonynewnham]

Hi (again)

As anadditional point, the Wingfield organ (reconstruction of a Medieval instrument) has keys narrower than the current standard - based IIRC on period examples from other keyboard instruments.  I found no great problem in playing Tallis on it.

Every Blessing

Tony

[Janner]

A very interesting response has just surfaced on the forum where this was originally raised. I suspect there are some who, like me, look at both boards, but for those who don't and may be interested, it may be worth posting a couple of links here:

http://www.steinbuhler.com/html/our_research.html

and, (solid reading, this):

http://appca.com.au/proceedings/2009/part_1/Boyle_Rhonda_Boyle_Robin.pdf

The above leads me to ponder a couple of things. For example, I wonder how many beginners have given up the piano simply because of straightforward physical difficulty in finding and covering the required notes? As the route to the organ often begins with the piano, has that had an effect on the number of organists around, both in the past and now?

Children in particular have small hands, and just at a time when they may be interested in learning, in fact the best time, when they are young.

There are smaller versions of some other instruments, such as 1/2 or 3/4 size cellos, but what about a decent, not a toy, childrens' piano? Perhaps there are. If so, would there be a logical case for them to be more widely used by music teachers and the like?

Finally, on a lighter note, (oh dear):

On the subject of chromatic buttons and the organ repertoire, the following may be of interest. (PLEASE NOTE: ORGANISTS with a delicate constitution or of nervous disposition may wish to prepare any medicinal draughts beforehand!)   :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VVFu8GQyWw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jgu2BlVqgHo

(Hope I don't get banned for posting that.)  ;D

[David Pinnegar]

Hi!

http://www.john-robert-brown.com/piano-tuning.htm

Steinway New York made three pianos for Josef Hofman (1876-1957). The keys were, I think, two millimetres narrower, so the keyboard was smaller, because he had small hands.'

Today the piano is more standardised. Most pianos are mass produced. Steinway pianos are still completely hand built, but usually with the standard keyboard.

Best wishes

David P

[revtonynewnham]

Do the forum moderators consider it worth starting a thread about organ music on the bayan, or taking a wider view of arrangements of organ music for different instrumentation?

Hi

Any board member can start a new topic within one of the existing headings - and the terms of reference of the board are pretty wide!
I personally see no objection to a thread of organ music arranged for other instruments.

Every Blessing

Tony